Webcast with Helga Zepp-LaRouche

‘You Cannot Gag an Entire Population’

Harley Schlanger: Hello, I’m Harley Schlanger. Welcome to our weekly dialogue with Helga Zepp-LaRouche, founder and chairwoman of the Schiller Institute. It’s Thursday, Aug. 18, 2022.

We’re in the middle of a month in which there are often wars starting, or accidents or miscalculations that lead to escalations of wars: We’re in exactly such a dangerous moment as that today. And Helga we should start with that, because we’re getting some very straight warnings coming out of Russia, about the escalation of the NATO use of Ukraine against the Russian forces, especially around the attacks on the nuclear plant. What do you have as the latest on that.

Helga Zepp-LaRouche: Well, it’s not so easy these days to discuss anything which has to do with Russia, Ukraine, the war danger, if you warn that things could potentially lead to World War III, you’re already accused of spouting and repeating Russian propaganda. But if you cannot discuss these questions any more, then obviously the condition of democracy, of free speech, the values of the “rules-based order,” are not so fantastic. So let’s do it anyway, because it is an increasingly dangerous situation.

Today, UN Secretary General Guterres and President of Turkey Erdoğan and President Zelensky are meeting in Kiev, and on the agenda is the export of grain from Ukraine, but also to find ways how to end the war. And I think any kind of such discussion can only be supported whole-heartedly. But in this context, the spokesman for the Russian Defense Ministry, Gen. Igor Konashenkov, has warned that there is an imminent provocation, which they have signs for, to occur at the moment when Guterres is in Kiev, which is practically now. And what he warns is that some provocation could occur in the context of the Zaporizhzhia nuclear plant, and that that would then be blamed on the Russian Federation, to escalate the whole anti-Russia campaign.

Now, Maria Zakharova, the spokeswoman for the Russian Foreign Ministry, also came out with very strong warnings, saying that in the context of this nuclear plant and possible incidents created around it, would represent nuclear blackmail not only of Ukraine and Russia, because obviously, if some accident would happen or some atrocity would happen, many European countries would be affected, and who knows what the consequences would be. So she calls this nuclear terrorism.

Now, obviously, there is right now an escalation of anti-Russian campaigns. The three Baltic countries, Poland, the Czech Republic, they are all already exercising a ban on all visas for Russians. They’re putting pressure that even the Schengen visa should be denied to Russians, in other words, denying them any entry into the European Union. And this is really incredible, after all the campaigns against Tchaikovsky, and the soprano Anna Netrebko and conductor Valery Gergiev, now the average Russian is supposed to be included. This is a witch-hunt which is extremely dangerous and I can only say this should stop! We need diplomacy, we need negotiations.

And when the Russian ambassador to the United States, Anatoly Antonov, is saying that the relationship between the United States and Russia has come to an almost complete halt, that everything which has been built up over the last decades in terms of channels, in terms of dialogue, has come apart, I can only say this is an extremely dangerous situation: Because even at the height of the Cuban Missile Crisis, you did have back-channels between the United States and the Soviet Union; you did have communication between President Kennedy and Khrushchev, and that is why the Cuban Missile Crisis did not lead to a catastrophe. Now, if all of these channels have been collapsed, and have broken down, and are being replaced by an anti-Russia hysteria, any citizen who is not concerned is not in the real world.

And this has nothing to do with Russian propaganda, what I’m saying: This is simply what any clear-thinking person would come to as a conclusion if you watch how the whole situation is going.

The recent reports about attacks on military installations in Crimea is also worrisome, because, first of all, Zelensky has said that he plans to retake Crimea. Crimea is regarded by Russia as being part of Russia. In any case, there are these strange contradictions, where the Ukrainians say these were attacks, and the Russians are saying, no, these were accidents. So one almost could assume that the Russians are concerned that they will be pulled into a confrontation, and they do not want it, and therefore they say, it was all the mistake of Russian soldiers.

In any case, these are question marks. It’s very difficult to come to a conclusion because this is a war zone, and therefore the reporting is very difficult. But I can only say: This has to change. And I can only hope that the meeting in Kiev today comes up with approaches to return to the negotiating table, because the idea that Russia must be defeated, that Ukraine must win the war—there are reports that the weapons deliveries by the West to Ukraine have slowed significantly since the beginning of July, basically, because many of the weapons which the Ukrainians say they need, the supply has been exhausted.

So the idea to continue this is absolutely playing with the existence of the entire human civilization, and anybody who is of a clear mind must demand a diplomatic solution. And again, I can only repeat, this is my opinion and not some Russian propaganda.

Schlanger: And as the danger increases, we’re seeing an escalation of the threat from the West against China, which has very severe implications, with the Pelosi visit to Taiwan and so on. And that was the subject of some comments by President Putin at the Moscow Conference on International Security this week.

Zepp-LaRouche: Yes. He gave full support to China and the One China policy, which is existing international law. There is a UN General Assembly resolution 2758, which clearly was a majority vote of the UN General Assembly, that China is one country, that Taiwan belongs to China, and that the Chinese official policy of “one country, two systems” is international law. And obviously, the United States has moved away by playing support for Taiwan independence; this is what Pelosi de facto did, and now there’s another delegation of U.S. Congress members there. And the Chinese have in the meantime, put out a White Paper, restating that peaceful unification remains Chinese official policy. And this is another area, where, if the red lines are being crossed, it’s a question of when this will lead to a big confrontation.

So we have to step back, and people have to really demand that all of these things should stop. And that we should go back to normal relations among great powers, because otherwise it could lead to a blowing up of the entire human species.

Schlanger: And as Putin is warning in this kind of escalated danger of great power confrontation, we’re seeing the Global South continuing to move away from acceptance of the idea of the U.S. and NATO as the sole superpower of the “rules-based order.” Most recently, we had the South African Defense Minister on a visit to Russia. This appears to be a very significant signal coming from one of the BRICS countries.

Zepp-LaRouche: Yes, because Secretary of State Blinken was just in South Africa, trying to assert maximum pressure that South Africa should not side with Russia. He got a very sharp answer from the South African Foreign Minister who said they’re an independent, sovereign country and don’t want to be pressured. Now, the South African Defense Minister went to the Moscow Conference on International Security, and I think it reflects a growing opinion and manifested opinion by many countries that used to belong to the Non-Aligned Movement, which is sort of in a renaissance that they do not want to be pulled back into bloc-building, that they do not want to be in a position where they have to choose between the West on the one side, and Russia and China on the other side. And the more countries that are taking that position the better, because, the idea to have a total confrontation and decoupling from the West, against Russia and China, the chances that that will not go ahead increases, when more of the developing countries say that they will not play that game. And then it becomes very clear that this is not a winning position by the West if they pursue that. And many countries are clearly stating that they want to not be in such a position: Brazil, Argentina, Indonesia, India, Nigeria, South Africa, and many of the smaller countries as well. So I think this is definitely something which has not even entered the minds of most politicians in Europe and the United States.

Schlanger: One of the countries that’s become a target for the pressure from the sole superpower grouping is India. And India is celebrating the 75th anniversary of its Independence. You’re going to be speaking Saturday at the Manhattan Project meeting about this.

This represents a very important potential rallying point for what you’re talking about, the formerly Non-Aligned Nations movement. How do you see the significance? You and your late husband played a very significant role in talking with Indian governments over the years.

Zepp-LaRouche: Yes. I think the whole LaRouche movement was greatly shaped by the experience of my late husband, when he was in India in 1946, at the big riots in Kolkata, which he experienced personally, and that gave him an impression of what the British Empire has been doing to the developing countries, and that had a significant part in shaping his view. We were in India many times: We worked with Indira Gandhi, with Rajiv Gandhi, on a 40-year development plan for India. And just now, Prime Minister Modi came out and said he wants to pursue a policy whereby India will be a fully developed country in 25 years from now, when the hundredth anniversary of Indian Independence occurs.

Now, that policy of modernization of India was put into motion many decades ago: This was Jawaharlal Nehru and his policy of a Green Revolution; this was the beginning of making India a leading world power in the IT sector. Sam Pitroda, who spoke at our recent Schiller conferences, can really be called the “father” of the IT industry in India. And today, there will be big changes because communications will change and transform the whole world, and will make oligarchical control much more difficult. And in space, India is one of the leading space nations, and there are many other areas.

So India plays an increasingly important role: It has as many people as China, 1.4 billion people, and the fact that Mahatma Gandhi was able to fight for Independence from the British Empire is absolutely important, because to remind his policy of non-violence in this world is more important than ever before, because the Five Principles of Peaceful Coexistence, the famous Panchsheel, what went into the Bandung conference and the UN Charter, naturally, also: A lot of ideas come really from Mahatma Gandhi and therefore, I think, to celebrate his ideas and to revive this is extremely important: So I want to invite all of you, please come and watch this program on Saturday, because this is an important part of world history that must be celebrated.

Schlanger: Now, in his talk at the Moscow Conference on International Security, Putin made the point that we’re going through a transition in the world, precisely what you were just saying, going away from the idea that one nation has the right to dictate policy to the rest of the world. Now, there are a number of battlegrounds for this: I’d like to discuss briefly the German situation, where we’re seeing motion from the farmers in Germany against the European Union green policy, but also warnings coming out about a very hot autumn. What’s your view of what’s coming up in Germany?

Zepp-LaRouche: Well, the German situation is completely insane, untenable. The present “streetlight coalition” in government, so-called, they’re pursuing a policy which will be the end of the German state as an industrial state! And this was fortunately now stated by the Vice President of the DIHK, the Association of German Chambers of Commerce and Industry. His name is Klaus Olbricht. He came out and said it was a big mistake for Germany to exit from nuclear energy. He’s also against the exit from coal. And he said it was completely untenable to do that, because Germany will cease to exist as an industrial state. And that’s very good: This is the first time, and I’ve been waiting for this, that a leading industrialist actually should say what everybody can see, that these present Green policies of Economy Minister Habeck and Foreign Minister Baerbock and all these people who obviously have no idea what a modern economy is about, they’re about to crush the German economy against the wall with their sanctions, with their Green stipulations. And there is a growing resistance against it, from the farmers—they’re now in harvest and therefore less on the streets than they normally would be; even so, there was a big demonstration in Bonn on Aug. 15, where the Agriculture Ministry still is. There will be a big demonstration in Dessau on Aug. 28, where craftsmen are saying “no to the sanctions,” open Nord Stream 2, stop the crazy policy against Russia.

All these things are legitimate: These are farmers who are producing the food. Also the interior secret service head is eating: The food he is eating is not coming from the sky, but it’s being produced by the farmers, and the farmers have the absolute right to demand that they have the right to do their business, namely, farming! The same goes for small and medium industry and so forth. Now the head of the Verfassungsschutz [Intelligence Office for Protection of the Constitution] came out and said, yeah, there will be a hot autumn and all kinds of extremist organizations are planning to take it over. The Interior Minister of the state of North Rhine-Westphalia said, “All of this is Russian propaganda.”

It’s not Russian propaganda, and maybe some extremist right-wing elements will be there, but you don’t solve the problem by criminalizing the protest preemptively! Correct the policies! Then there would be no protests in the street.

And I think this is exactly what we have to demand: We need a complete change, we need a doubling of the food production because we have a world famine. We need to have a reorganization of the bankrupt financial system—this is why we are organizing for the New Bretton Woods Ad Hoc Committee, which you should sign onto. Go to our website, read it, sign it, spread it.

And you cannot put a gag order on the entire population, when obviously things are not right. And criminalizing even the discussion about it, I think this will backfire and cause an incredible blowback, because that is not how you solve problems.

Schlanger: We’re seeing something similar in the United States around the decision by the Justice Department, which your husband had described as an out-of-control permanent bureau—but the Justice Department and FBI raid on the home of former President Trump certainly adds to the sense of polarization. We had the very good defeat in the Wyoming primary of Liz Cheney on Tuesday. Now we’re getting reports—a return of the discussion of pipe bombs that were in place on January 6.

It does seem as though the U.S. situation—on the one side, people are reacting against these policies, but on the other side there’s an attempt to turn it into a chaotic each-against-all battle.

Zepp-LaRouche: Well, the story with the pipe bombs is very ominous, because now it’s come out that supposedly there were pipe bombs placed in the vicinity of the headquarters of the Republican and Democratic National Committees, the day before January 6, namely on January 5, and that they were in such locations that if you had had any security sense, they should have been discovered. But ominously, they were discovered minutes before the march into the Capitol occurred. Nothing happened because they were discovered, but this is all very, very ominous and deserves further investigation.

But I think the polarization we’re talking about in the United States indeed, is extremely worrisome. And the raid against Trump is unprecedented for a President of the United States, but this is light, compared to what occurred to my late husband and myself in 1986, when we had 10 times as many FBI and law enforcement agents raiding our homes and offices. And this is an experience you don’t tend to forget.

Schlanger: Let’s come back to what you brought up earlier, the Ad Hoc Committee for a New Bretton Woods: This is a major focus for the Schiller Institute work and has been for many years, but it’s particularly prescient now given the inflation problem, the breakdown of supply chains, the deindustrialization, privatization, danger of debt defaults: How can people get involved in our mobilization for a new security and financial architecture?

Zepp-LaRouche: Well, the first step is, we will put out internationally a press release today about a letter that will be delivered to six committees in the U.S. Congress, in the House and in the Senate—the Committees for Judiciary, Foreign Affairs, and Intelligence—where 16 prominent Americans who were on the Ukrainian blacklist by the Center for Countering Disinformation—being on a hitlist practically—they are reacting and they are demanding now from the U.S. Congress for an investigation about the misuse of taxpayer money to finance an institution in Kiev, which is trying to prevent the right of American citizens to exercise their free speech. So this will be very interesting. The letter is signed by prominent people, such as Scott Ritter, the former UN weapons inspector in Iraq; by Ray McGovern, who’s well known internationally; and many others.

So the first thing you can do is get this press release around, because this is something that should be replicated in other countries’ parliaments where citizens were on that list, including France, Italy, Germany, Denmark, India, China, and others. That’s the first step.

The second is, we have to have a complete change in the international order: We have to have a new credit system, because the old one is about to blow out in a hyperinflationary collapse. Inflation in the UK for example, is already above 10%. This is eating the life savings of people, and you cannot continue that and not think that people will not protest! Many people will not be able to make ends meet, if this inflation continues. And the idea of criminalizing protest is just not going to work.

So join our effort to put a new agenda on the table: A New Bretton Woods to do exactly what Franklin D. Roosevelt did in 1933, when he reacted to a situation which was similar, not in all aspects, but had many similar characteristics. And we need a New Bretton Woods system to put the world into order, and it has to be all-inclusive; together with a new security order which takes in the interests of every single country. We are known as the “solution people,” so join us, because we are one of the few organizations—if not the only one, but for sure one of the few—that have worked on this for a very long time. We have sought out solutions based on the ideas of my late husband Lyndon LaRouche, and all of his warnings are now obvious to anybody who is honest, and so are the solutions he proposed, many, many years ago.

So, if you are interested to do something for your own future, join our efforts!

Schlanger: And you can join Helga and Sam Pitroda, whom she mentioned earlier, at the event this Saturday, August 20, The Manhattan Project meeting, to celebrate the 75th anniversary of Indian Independence. You can find it on the Schiller Institute website here.

Helga, thanks for joining us this week, and we’ll see you again next week.

Zepp-LaRouche: Yes, till next week!